Land/Sea Battle System

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Land/Sea Battle System

Post  cooki3 on Sun Sep 09, 2012 4:43 pm

Greeting and salutations old cookies, here I present a short rundown of my simple battle scheme that most people semed to like.

How succesful each turn is gets determined by a dice roll. For example we say Tium attacks rebels. If he rolls a 90 on ambush phase, he will take little casualties. if he rolls 4, a lot of casualties. If the battle is between 2 players then it can be decided for whom the dice gets rolled. Also some rules can be applicable, for example if you roll a 100 then you get a crackshot and kill the enemy general, and if you get a 1 then your own general pops his clogs. This whole dice business is really to the battle maker's preference.

Now the phases. Each phase is dependent on a specific type of units.

[Ambush Phase] This phase is where the defender gets the drop on the attacker. the effect is mainly determined by defender's quantity and quality of missile units such as xbowmen and archers, alternatively light cavalry. If it's missile troops, the ambusher takes minimal casualties unless he rolls a really bad dice. Those of us who play m2tw can also apply the comon stuff like crossbowmen do most damage to heavy armor and bowmen do most damage to light armor. units without shields take extra damage - pikemen/halbers, zweihanders, light cav, archers/xbows

Attacker important units:

Defender important units:
Light cavalry

[Retailation Phase] The attacker strikes back at the ambusher/defender. This is ambush the other way around, meaning the attacker gets minimal casualties. However it's not as effective because the enemy is ready for the counterstrike. Missile/light cav here. Note that if the attacker gets a bad roll, his cavalry might come across some laid stakes and take extra casualties during this phase.

Attacker important units:
Light cavalry

Defender important units:
Missiles that can plant stakes

[Clash Phase] This is the most important phase, where armies charge at eachother if in open field/the attacker storms the defender fortress. I noticed a strange lack of siege weapons of any kind in your armies old grains, such as catapults siege towers and the like? Well anyway. This phase takes into account the attacker's shock troops such as swordsmen, axemen and heavy cavalry; and defender's defensive troops such as spearmen, pikemen and halberdiers. Javelins can also make good defensive troops when positioned behind a line so they can lob pointy things over it. The attacker inflicts the most damage here usually, but it can be the other way around if the defender has the right type of units and the dice on his side.

Attacker important units:
Heavy Cavalry

Defender important units:

[Battle Phase] This is where the remaining dudes do fair battle with eachother. It boils down to troops quality and numbers, but again relevance matters: zweihanders aren't good at holding a line, while spearmen aren't good at breaking one.

Attacker important units:
All troops (bonus if offensive oriented)

Defender important units:
All troops (bonus if defensive oriented)

As you can see, storming a city with a bunch of pikemen won't do you much good. And such. Use common sense, like you do in M2. If you have any input please post it old pies! :ph34r:


Allright ye rapscallions I have decided to make a trait rundown for each type of unit. Our high iq chaps could use this to calculate the battle more precisely, otherwise it's just a read for fun.

Units can't be used in ambush/retaliation phases unless stated otherwise.
Some factions are also better at using some unit types than others.
I have not included war beasts and siege weapons yet, will do if there is demand.

Peasant quality one -3 to all stats
Militia quality two -2 to all stats
Regular quality three -1 to all stats
Professional quality four all stats default
Elite quality five +1 to all stats
Knight quality six +2 to all stats
Ninja quality seven +3 to all stats (i just had to, sory lol)

FACTION-BASED MODIFIERS (stack with the above)


FACTION-SPECIFIC MODIFIERS (stack with the above)

Hoplites +3
Archers/Slingers + 1
Any Cavalry Unit - 2

Italians (Yes, I'll add some post marian Roman bonuses)
Legionaries +3
Heavy Cavalry + 1
Light Infantry/Cavalry - 2

Hoplites +2
Non-Carthaginian units +1
Carthaginian Units = 1 quality more expensive then it should be ex: Q2 - Q3 expenses

Light Infantry +1
Light Cavalry (includes HA) + 3
Heavy Infantry - 2

Barbarian (Celts, Iberians, Gaul/Germanic peoples, etc.)
Medium Infantry + 3
Archers +1
Heavy Infantry - 1
Heavy Cavalry - 1

Pikes +3
Any Cavalry +1
Archers -1
Medium Infantry -1

Thracians/Greek Barbarians
Medium Infantry +2
Skirmishers +2
Pike men -1
Heavy Cavalry -1

Light Infantry +2
Archers +2
Heavy Cavalry - 2

TERRAIN MODIFIERS (stack with the above)
Each battlefield has a terrain that affects performance of different types of units. This usually turn out in the defender's favor, because it is they who get to choose where they fight and can also prepare properly. And tell me if i forgot any terrain.
-No modifiers.
-Light cavalry loses their ability to participate in ambush/retaliation phases
-Missile troops gain a -2 penalty to attack
Dense Forest/Swamp
-Light cavalry loses their ability to participate in ambush/retaliation phases
-Missile troops gain a -3 penalty to attack
-All melee units lose their charge bonus on clash phase
-Defending missile units gain a +2 bonus to attack
-Heavy cavalry gains an additional charge bonus on clash phase
-Defending missile units gain a +3 bonus to attack
-Heavy cavalry lose their charge bonus on clash phase
-Defending missile troops gain a +3 bonus to attack
-Defending pikemen and halberdiers gain a +3 bonus to melee defense
-Heavy cavalry lose their charge bonus on clash phase

This is my explanation of unit types. After the base stats there are special properties which add bonuses or penalties on top of the stats. Also shows minimum and maxim allowed quality for the units. You can't have peasant knights! Noble knifemen aren't too likely either.

Melee Atk – 8
Melee Def – 7
Missile Def – 4
Weak against cavalry
Strong against any infantry

Light infantry 1-5, 7
Melee Atk – 2
Melee Def – 4
Missile Def – 3
Weak against cavalry
Fast movement means they can be used in either ambush/retaliation phases

Swordsmen 3-6
Melee Atk – 4
Melee Def – 6
Missile Def – 5
Strong against infantry

Macemen and Axemen 1-6
Melee Atk – 2
Melee Def – 6
Missile Def – 5
Strong against infantry
Strong against armor
Weak against cavalry

Two-handed Swordsmen 4-6
Melee Atk – 7
Melee Def – 4
Missile Def – 2
Very strong against infantry
Weak against missiles
Strong charge

Two-handed Axemen and Macemen 4-6
Melee Atk – 5
Melee Def – 4
Missile Def – 2
Very strong against infantry
Strong against armor
Strong charge
Weak against missiles

Spearmen 1-5
Melee Atk – 3
Melee Def – 7
Missile Def – 8
Weak against infantry
Strong against cavalry

Hoplites 2-5
Melee Atk – 7
Melee Def – 8
Missile Def – 2
Strong against heavy cavalry/Infantry/missiles
Weak against light cavalry/legionaries

Pikemen 2-5
Melee Atk – 5
Melee Def – 10
Missile Def – 2
Very strong against cavalry
Weak against missiles

Archers 1-5
Missile Atk – 4
Melee Def – 2
Missile Def – 2
Weak against cavalry
Fast fire rate means 1 volley on either ambush/retaliation phase + 1 volley on clash phase

Javelins 1-5
Missile Atk – 6
Melee Def – 3
Missile Def – 2
Strong against armor
Weak against cavalry
Slow fire rate means 1 volley on either ambush/retaliation phase

Light cavalry (lancers and so on) 3-5
Melee Atk – 4
Melee Def – 4
Missile Def – 3
Very strong against missiles
Fast movement means they can be used in ambush/retaliation phases

Heavy Cavalry (cataphracts/companions/etc.) 5-6
Melee Atk – 4
Melee Def – 7
Missile Def – 5
Strong against missiles
Powerful charge deals extra damage on clash phase

Horse Archers/Javelins 2-5
Missile Atk – 3
Melee Def – 4
Missile Def – 2
Weak against missiles
Fast movement means they can be used in ambush/retaliation phases

Elephants 5-6
Melee Atk – 9
Melee Def – 9
Missile Def – 5
Strong against infantry and cavalry
Powerful charge deals extra damage on clash phase
Very weak against missiles and skirmishing cavalry and camels

Chariots 5-6
Melee Atk – 8
Melee Def – 8
Missile Def – 5
Strong against infantry and cavalry
Weak against missiles and pikes/hoplites

Camels are priced as horses

NOTE ON VERSATILE UNITS: versatile units are equipped with both a ranged and a melee weapon. Their ranged attack is used for ambush/retaliation phase and their melee attack for clash and battle phase. They sacrifice specialization however - a versatile spearman won't get his anti-cav bonus, and a versatile crossbowman won't get his anti-armor bonus. Don't forget this when making your units! Having many weapons isn't always practical. Also note that anti-unit type penalties still apply as usual!

NOTE ON BASIC UNIT NAMES: You may name your non-unique units as well, but you'll have to state their quality and class in parenthesis. I for example didn't understand what a laddock is until I googled it.

NOTE ON UNIQUE UNITS: I have decided that unique units will not have a quality rating because their stats are custom anyway. Stats will also be decided by me, because people have no moderation with that stuff. You will have to make a simple description of units and their abilities, and I'll distribute stats and properties accordingly.


DON'T MAKE YOUR NAVIES YET, this is a beta and it won't be final until people start leaving some goddamn feedback.

First and foremost, the system I have in mind would be extremely tedious and complicated when used with a large number of ships. So I'm proposing each faction has a small number of ships, but insted treasures them dearly and not just throws them away for slaughter like you do with soldiers. It'd create a sence of attachment to your naval units and make room for a personality, rather than just "those 50000 swordmen"

for some reason this reminds me of pokemon.. but thats a good thing, I like pokemon! xD

[Sabotage Phase] Only applicable if SNEAKY-type submarines are present on one or both sides. The available submarines perform their tasks and sabotage the enemy fleet before the battle. This isn't very urgent yet, I'll work it out later.

[Siege Phase] Only applicable if ships with long-range weapons such as trebuchets or rockets are present. This isn't very actual either yet.

[Skirmish Phase] Ranged weapons are used as described below. Effects applied. Nothing fancy.

[Boarding Phase] Applicable if grapple shot was successfully used by anyone on anyone. The formula goes like this:

crew size x crew skill x number of ships in squadron + 200% of a roll

- whoever scores a higher number wins the melee
- those who won the melee keep their captured ships if they win the battle, otherwise they are returned to their owners
- squadrons that arent boaring anything behave as in skirmish phase
- squadrons engaged in boarding cannot be targeted by ranged weapons (can be rammed)

[Duel Phase] Whatever remained after the above repeats skirmish phase until a side has been defeated. Grapple shot cannot be used.

I encourage that everybody makes a separate navy topic in their faction forum and specify their strategies. Don't forget to state when to retreat from the battle! (example: retreat after 50% casualties) or you will lose your whole fleet if the battle goes badly. Retreating from a battle counts as a loss, meaning you lose all dismasted ships and those with damaged hull status.

Allright here we go, i have found a way to have any amount of ships in your fleet. The fleet is divided in squadrons - each squadron consist of one type of ship, so taht they can move freely and not as fast as the slowest member. This also simplifies the issuing of orders. Example:

Squadron 1
200 galleys

Squadron 2
50 warships

Squadron 3
10 battleships

Each squadron can be issued their own order each phase. The available orders depend on the ship type - you can choose any ammo type that can be fired from weapons mounted on that type of ship. Each squadron can attack one enemy squadron at a time. Example:

(don't confuse flaming bolt and flaming shot.. might rename to make it clearer)

Squadron 1
Enemy squadron 2 - Ram

Squadron 2
Enemy Squadron 2 - Heavy Bolt

Squadron 3
Enemy squadron 3 - Flaming Shot

So. Each roll is made, if succesful, the damage of the attack is multiplied by the amount of ships in the squadron. The sum is deducted from the enemy ships's hitpoints multiplied by the number of ships in the target squadron. Example:

Enemy Suadron 1
100 warships = 10,000 hitpoints
takes Ram damage 30x200 = 6,000 damage
60 ships lost*

I know this is crude, I'll refine it later. *I'll also increase ship hitpoints of course. Something separate will have to be done with effects such as fire - your squadron rolls 82 on flaming bolt and sets every enemy ship on fire? Even I am not that casual to realism. Well, wadda ya think so far? I want feedback!

There's a number of different weapons that can be planted on ships. Each weapon has an array of ammunition. Some weapons will not be available on standard ships, you'll see which and why.

Damage – This is constant and is inflicted if the attack hits.

Spread – The attack hits only if it rolls this number or above

Ship Evasion – modifies the spread roll against that ship

Status – some ammo types have special properties that inflict a status on the enemy, each status is exlplained later

An archaic tool, it is still just as effective as ever. Galleys can use this to damage larger ships. Can be used on medium ships and above.

Damage - 20
Spread - 40
Roll 80+ to damage the target's hull.

Light Ballista
This weapon cannot fire any advanced projectiles, but is exceptionally accurate, making it effective against small ships.

Light Bolt
Damage – 20
Spread – 10

This weapon can fire an array of advanced projectiles, and is effective against medium ships and above.

Heavy Bolt
Damage – 30
Spread – 20

Flaming Bolt
Damage – 30
Spread – 40
Roll 80+ to set the target on fire.

Grapple Shot
Damage – 0
Spread – 40
Captures the target to allow for aboardage. Can only be used on ships of the same class or lighter.

Chain Shot
Damage – 10
Spread – 60
Roll 80+ to dismast the target.

Repeating Ballista (NOT AVAILABLE)
This weapon fires multiple projectiles at the enemy and is effective against medium ships and above.

Damage – 40
Spread - 20

Magasine Shot
Damage – 50
Spread – 40

This weapon can fire an array of powerful advanced projectiles. Effective against heavy ships.

Solid Shot
Damage – 60
Spread – 50

Flaming Shot
Damage – 60
Spread – 70
Roll 80+ to set the target on fire.

Fuel Bomb
Damage – random
Spread – 50
-Damage calculated by a separate roll. If the attack misses, the damage is inflicted on a random friendly squardon. A true gamble!

This weapon can fire solid shots over long distances. Can be used against heavy ships.

Solid Shot
Damage – 70
Spread – 50
Used on siege phase


Galley/light ship

Cost - 1,000f
Hull strength – 150
Crew size/skill - 50/1
Evasion + 10
Armament – light ballista and ram

Warship/medium ship

Cost - 4,000f
Hull strength – 300
Crew size/skill - 200/1
Evasion 0
Armament – light ballista and ballista

Battleship/heavy ship

Cost - 10,000f
Hull strength – 600
Crew size/skill - 500/1
Evasion -10
Armament – light ballista, ballista and catapult

Barbary Xebec/special light ship

Hull Strength - 100
Evasion + 30
Crew size/skill - 100/3
Armament - none
- Cannot be issued orders during skirmish phase
- Roll 40+ in boarding phase to board the enemy, otherwise wait one turn and try again (ninjas dont need grapples and ropes, they can jump! HOOOAAAHH!!)
I had to include this because these things are present in many fleets now

There will be less navy qialities, and the stat difference will be much more substantial. The qiualities aren't tiered, but rather reflect different strengths.

- default stats and cost

x2 cost
+150% hull strength
-30 evasion

x3 cost
+1 crew skill
+20 evasion

Reinforced Veteran
x4 cost
+1 crew skill
-20 evasion

Pirate (not available)
default cost
-25% hull strength
+1 crew skill
+10 evasion

On fire – as the fire spreads, the afflicted ship takes 10 damage on the turn after the status was inflicted, 20 on the next, 30 on the next and so on. Burning ships are doomed and are always destroyed after the battle ends, even if they still have hitpoints left.
Damaged hull - as the ship takes on water, it takes 10 damage on the turn after the status was inflicted, 20 on the next, 30 on the next and so on. Damaged ships can be restored to function if the battle was won and the ship has hitpoints left. Otherwise destroyed.
Dismasted – evasion decreased by 30. Dismasted ships are counted as POW if the battle is lost, restored to function otherwise.


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